Agent 91 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) Every D lineman in every game has his hands up at some point when the QB is dropping back. One of the tallest QBs has to see what's right in front of him (ober and over). Roll out, pump fake....something. The O-linemen can't get away with holding on every play... It's not a hold. As soon as that d lineman jumps you are supposed to be there to jam him and knock him off balance or flatten his butt. A good lineman will not allow a man to jump get his arms up and land back on his feet. Was the batted pass on EJ? If you want it to be, sure. But like JFH said, it's OL 101. Let me ask you this. Why do you think there aren't 4 linemen jumping you bat down balls every play? It's it not because they don't have balance and their foot timing is messed up. The o line is supposed to be creating throwing lanes. Regardless if what the qb does with it. Edited August 6, 2014 by Agent 91 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) People do realize that most of the time (not always but most) that batted down passes are on the O line and not the QB? Offensive linemen are taught to get the arms down of defensive linemen on pass plays....its football 101. I didnt like the almost int that EJ through last night (although...lets be real...LOTS of good QB's throw almost int's).....but for some reason people are blaming EJ for the batted passes as well. I played OL at a pretty decent level and was never taught to grab a guys arms, its called holding. If a defender sees its a quick set by the QB he will back up and try to get in the lane, normally on a 3 step drop you cut the lineman at the knees to open that lane. Edited August 5, 2014 by BUFFALOTONE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 It's not clear. 10 career starts doesn't make anything objectively clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 91 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Does that count the 3rd one where the defender in a vanilla preseason scheme did nothing on the play except drop back away from the online and react to EJs throw? No I already can concede that was a bad read and bad pass. He was trying to force feed Watkins. I think he just wanted him to touch the ball in pre-season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 And he was right 6 times. Day one of offensive linemen school: defensive linemen puts his hands up, take their feet out. But I'm assuming you didn't play football at any level. You strike me more as a debate guy. It's silly isn't it? I have no idea how good EJ will be but it's kinda sickening how some fans have no patience. QB might be the hardest position in all of sports. It's takes time. Thankfully, I think EJ is a lot more mature than some of the fans who freak out after every pass. That's correct Biscuit but not what John said, he said to grab the DLs arms. You have to cut him down, but if he reads it and doesn't rush there isn't much the OL man can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voodoo poonani Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 And what about the LB who read EJs eyes while he stared down Sammy? How is that the OL's fault? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 91 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) sometimes I wonder what game people are watching. The JPP swat was NOT on Henderson. He handled JPP that play, JPP took a drop step when he realized he wasn't getting any push. EJ threw it right at him...EJ's fault. 2nd swat was on Urbik. Williams's near TD...tough to catch anything when the DB has your inside arm hooked. Am I alone in seeing how dominant Stefan Charles was? Dude was in the backfield every play. You are not alone. The other guy. I want to say Corbin Bryant? (have to rewatch for the name) Was making plays as well. I think the DT spot looks great. Correction: his name was Landon Cohen Edited August 6, 2014 by Agent 91 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermontbill Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Also Sammy is going to find that he is exposed at Press coverage, they are going to bump him at the line and he is going to be off his route. EJ and the staff have to recognize that, as that is the game plan for speed, whether its Sammy or anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 5, 2014 Author Share Posted August 5, 2014 I played OL at a pretty decent level and was never taught to grab a guys arms, its called holding. If a defender sees its a quick set by the QB he will back up and try to get in the lane, normally on a 3 step drop you cut the lineman at the knees to open that lane. At no point in any post I have made in this thread have I said that the OL should hold the DL......not one You can reach out and "punch" the defender.......which will bring his hands down to get his balance or he might fall over...... And two of those batted passes the defender was not that far away And what about the LB who read EJs eyes while he stared down Sammy? How is that the OL's fault? Its not....read more That's correct Biscuit but not what John said, he said to grab the DLs arms. You have to cut him down, but if he reads it and doesn't rush there isn't much the OL man can do. Please show me where I said to grab the DL's arms..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 That's not a proper comparison, because Moulds was much more NFL ready than EJ is. He played very well when he was on the field and given the opportunities. But since Marv wanted to teach him a lesson, he rarely saw the field in his first two years. Things miraculously changed with a new coaching staff. Totally different circumstance. Moulds has less than 300 yards his second year as well. Perhaps he wasn't as NFL ready as you remember? http://m.pfref.com/m?p=XXplayersXXMXXMoulEr00.htm&t=0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 At no point in any post I have made in this thread have I said that the OL should hold the DL......not one You can reach out and "punch" the defender.......which will bring his hands down to get his balance or he might fall over...... And two of those batted passes the defender was not that far away Its not....read more Please show me where I said to grab the DL's arms..... "Offensive linemen are taught to get the arms down of defensive linemen on pass plays....its football 101." I took this as holding as the only other way to do this is chopping the DL on a short drop. If the DL disengages and reads the play it is not the OLs fault. On short drops your cut the player, that's football 101 or OL 101. My guess is they didn't want to do that in preseason. You can "punch" a guy in the chest but not sure its going to bring his arms down, especially if hes backing off the line. It happens and its not really a concern to me. But Marrone not wanting to put that on his QB is questionable IMO. You're not wrong but the explanation was confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 "Offensive linemen are taught to get the arms down of defensive linemen on pass plays....its football 101." I took this as holding as the only other way to do this is chopping the DL on a short drop. If the DL disengages and reads the play it is not the OLs fault. On short drops your cut the player, that's football 101 or OL 101. My guess is they didn't want to do that in preseason. You can "punch" a guy in the chest but not sure its going to bring his arms down, especially if hes backing off the line. It happens and its not really a concern to me. But Marrone not wanting to put that on his QB is questionable IMO. You're not wrong but the explanation was confusing. You get the hell out of here with actual football talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 It's not clear. 10 career starts doesn't make anything objectively clear. Simply not true, he's obviously a bust. I've read so here. Batted passes at the LoS equal bust city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 5, 2014 Author Share Posted August 5, 2014 "Offensive linemen are taught to get the arms down of defensive linemen on pass plays....its football 101." I took this as holding as the only other way to do this is chopping the DL on a short drop. If the DL disengages and reads the play it is not the OLs fault. On short drops your cut the player, that's football 101 or OL 101. My guess is they didn't want to do that in preseason. You can "punch" a guy in the chest but not sure its going to bring his arms down, especially if hes backing off the line. It happens and its not really a concern to me. But Marrone not wanting to put that on his QB is questionable IMO. You're not wrong but the explanation was confusing. I actually say Cyrus K. trying to do the cutting technique several times (it dismayed me as he looked so awkward doing it) Jamie Nails had a pass protection punch that is so strong that it injured another player just from that When I played (and coached) the idea was to "punch" not in the chest but a little lower....and force the D linemen to defend himself and not want to extend his wingspan to go for a ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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